You know, I don't think Walkabout has any references to the events of War Without End, so you could flip the order and stick Walkabout in there.

Hi, Matt and Gillian!

Sorry this is late, but I have a few semi-spoilery thoughts on “A Late Delivery from Avalon” for your consideration. (I got very behind on my podcast listening and have just caught up.)

When B5 was originally on the air, there was a great deal of discussion on various usenet groups and other online forums about the similarities between B5 and Lord of the Rings, often with the implication that Straczynski was just ripping off Tolkien. This episode was, to a certain extent, his way of reminding fans that Middle Earth is far from the only mythos out there with heroes and stories like the ones he was busily creating. It also was a hint that the show is intended to be a heroic epic of the Joseph Campbell variety, which tend not to end in easy “happily-ever-afters”.

I acknowledge that the episode is flawed for the reasons that you described in the last podcast, but I’m inclined to overlook these flaws because I think the episode is important to the series and I don’t mind the clumsier bits as much as Gillian clearly does. Through David’s story, we are reminded once again about how terrible the experience of war is (something JMS likes to emphasize as often as possible) and how terrible the Earth-Minbari war, in particular, was for the human population. When the show was still on the air, with repeats quite rare and no alternative ways of watching, newer viewers would have lacked information about the war and even some of the… ahem… more experienced viewers may have needed a reminder, as not all of us were geeky enough to tape every episode. At this point in the series, viewers who started particularly late in the game could be forgiven for thinking that the relationship between Earth and Minbar has always been as cozy as the relationship between Sheridan and Delenn has become, as the last episode that gave much detail on the war was “There All the Honor Lies” and the war is no longer mentioned in the opening credits.



Anyway, one thing I’ve always wondered about was how Franklin and Marcus explained the situation to Delenn when they asked her to help them out after Franklin dishes out some of the worst therapy since Nurse Ratched. “Um, Ambassador, I did a bad. Could you maybe come down to Medlab and take a sword from this guy who thinks he’s a hero from Earth mythology because he feels responsible for starting the Earth-Minbari war? We think he might give it to you because you’re, like, a pretty lady and stuff.”

Sorry to ramble on so much. Keep up the good work.

First, please tell me (or spoiler tag) walkabout stuff if you think its required, but I'm assuming these are the two watched as instructed.

Was surprised you didn't just do a single episode for Interludes and Walkabout, I mean that puts off Gray 17 by at least a month.

Interludes and Examinations

A very meaty episode indeed. In normal circumstances the Vorlon vs Shadows and Kosh's sacrifice would be the main talking point of the Episode, and it is great stuff. Sherridan vs Kosh is a tense, dramatic scene and Boxlitner really sells Sherridan's fustration and desperation in trying to unite the non-aligned bitches against the Shadows. While the Vorlon's seem to absolutely paste the shadows in a brilliant space battle, I did assume this was due to the shadows coming out to fry a few minor ships and not expecting to face Vorlon's. Kosh likes impersonating people's dads doesn't he. Quite a touching final exchange. of course the actual standout in this episode is Peter Jurasic. Londo's excitement is infectious and his utter sorrow in the tragic is deeply moving, and just when you think you can't hate Morden any more we get this. Nearly forgot, we also have the brilliant scenes where Franklyn's Stim addiction nearly takes a life. Your heart goes out to Garibaldi who is desperately trying to help his friend without ending his carreer, but needs to do something, knowing Franklyn will never forgive himself if he actually looses a patient.



Walkabout

Just to get the slightly bad, I wasn't sure about the musical interludes, felt a bit like when a series has a special guest star musician, like the A-Team episode with Boy George in it. Was she a famous musician? Anyhoo, Stephen is on walkabout. I like how we get drips and drabs of info about Foundationism. The incorporation of bits form many earth religions is consistent with what we've heard so far. Quite a nice twist when the singer turns out not to be an addict like we are made to suspect. Meanwhile Sherridan & Co Meet the new Vorlon, who will only tell them his name is Kosh. I assume this is Vorlon mucking about and that every Vorlon isn't actually called Kosh. A bit like the planet in south park where every person, place and thing is called "Marklar". They also test telepaths as Shadow Jammers (That will be the name of my 80's Hair Metal Band) Good to see the resiliance of shadow ships even when immobilised.

A decent pair of episodes. Keep it up.

Great episode. I love the end. Its a real case of "ohhh shit!".

The Thunderbolt Star Furies were seen in Severed Dreams in the big fight, but also during the bombing run on Mars, so we see them operating in an atmosphere before we hear it. Not sure how useful this design would be in space though compared to the standard design, as it would weigh more, and would not be able to manouver as fast, although it has missiles in addition to its guns.

Bester joins the war. How senior is Bester in the Psicorp?

Quick aside to Charly, I actually heard the Thunderbolt Starfuries were initially created to make the dogfights in Severed Dreams easier to follow. Earth Loyalists had Thunderbolts, B5 and Rebels had Old style. Would have to watch again to check if it actually works like that. Agree that they would have a disadvantage in space combat to a regular starfury unless engines and manouvering thrusters had been uprated to compensate.

Ok, thought i'd just cover this story as one big lump. However, 1 month break, you can't put off Gray 17 for ever you know. Admittedly I'm not looking forward to that either because I have to watch it too and also I'm not a monster.

Anyway, War without End, or to use the "Friends" style episode title that turned up in the SFX letters page many moons ago:

"The one with The One, The One, The One, Not The One and the Big Green Space Station"

First with the bad, as bad news refuses to wait. A couple of bits of this seem kind of forced, as if they're trying to gaffer tape the stuff set up in Babylon Squared to the current status of the show and possible different directions that were taken, at times it feels like they had various story "waypoints" to reach, Such as someone has to be in a space suit fading in and out and at the end we had to have old sinclair grumbling about warning people. The distress call from the future is a bit of an old SF red herring, usually used to put something shocking in the trailer, still the actual scene is good and does pack the required punch. The episodes use a fair stack of stock footage as well, once again, in B5 everyone remembers in Black and white.

Despite these faults its actually a pretty enjoyable episode. It does a good job of linking up various dangling plot points, plus explaining a great deal about Mimbari religion. I know people who now shout "Holy Jeff" every time Delenn says "In valen's Name" if it wasn't so well done it would be a bit of a let down to find out this big important valen guy is some bloke called Jeff.

The future flashes were very good, in effect we see the conclusion of Londo and G'Kar's plotlines here and there are solid performances all round. I love the difference between Londo playing the bastard for his keeper, compared to his more reasonable self when it's asleep.



There is a bit of Timey-Wimey stuff in this ep as well, but it's mostly delivered by Zathras which kind of makes everything ok. Zathras is always fun to watch and manages to take what should be a Jar Jar binks type comedy character and make it charming and fun. Lucas you beardy git, this is how you do it.

Finally, We see more of B4 here, and I like how some corridors and C&C are basically teh smae sets but eitehr lit differently or always shot from different angles (Not hot on how they do this but I had to concentrate to see it was the same set) very effective.

Shock and horror, the epsisode Gray 17 is missing seems to be missing from my DVD, honest guv. I may investigate or I could just see you back here for "And the rock cried out no hiding place" eh? No. Damn.

Cheeky Edits

Couple of final points. First, Sinclair's warning is just "Watch your back Garibaldi" Seriously he gives Walker Smith's (Sorry, Wahlker Smeeeeth) Warning. Not "Your deputy is a traitor" or Don't trust whatsisname"

Second, Lenir is really becoming a bit of a techno-exposition officer on the White Star. There was the bit in ship of tears where he explains the tractor beam, and now he goes into a longwinded explanation of the whitestar's Vorlon defences. It is a bit unlike B5 to do this and I wonder, is it a joke at Trek's expense. Both times Sherridan's replys seem to verge very close to saying "Lenir, I really don't care provided it works"

Keep up the good work, In Jeff's Name.

Ok some random thoughts.
Severed Dreams - Did you know that originally Delenn was unable to break the staff in the first few takes and they had to weaken it for her? It's in the commentary track.

Late delivery from Avalon - Stephen being a Dick,did he learn nothing from Believers?

Walkabout - Stephen being a dick again also it's not Kosh Vader... He's BatKosh.

The White Phoenix wrote:


Yep, we knew that. Or Gillian did. We discuss it in episode 28.

The White Phoenix wrote:


Nope, he didn't. He's a dick. But...



The White Phoenix wrote:


Kosh Vader FTW dude. Srsly.

Just wanted to day I agreee with Gillians opinion on Franklins declaration of addiction being in the numbers.

That does not make sense. Surely you can test blood to see how much of a substance can be found, but addiction (to a stimulant) is more of a psychological dependence that a physical one. And no two peoples physiology is the same, so it would be hard to quantify anyway. People can handle different amounts of drugs, and its not always directly related to body mass for example.

So he could check and see that he has been taking a lot of stims, but surely thats all it can tell.

I don’t think it’s possible for me to talk about this mega-episode without spoilers so I’m not even going to try.



This was a great pair of episodes that whet one’s appetite for the delights in store for us in the fabulously enchanting episode…”Grey 17 is Missing”

Oh, and, now that we’ve all seen War Without End, here’s a couple cheeky ideas for a John/Delenn ship song: